Last week, Dorothy saw a mouse in the kitchen. This is the first time either of us has seen an unwanted rodent since we’ve left home, so we’ve no experience dealing with this. We thought about what to do and, us being tolerent, non-specist types, we thought live and let live. Perhaps he was passing through. We peeked around and couldn’t find any mouse poo, so we figured he probably hadn’t done us any harm, why should we try to hurt him?
In a bit that is now, sadly, connected, a couple of weeks ago we made a fruitcake. It had been aging, with us adding brandy every few days, and eating some periodically. We had decided that two weeks was long enough to wait for our first fruitcake, so we planned to eat the last of it this weekend. Now I don’t normally complain about the cost of making food, but fruitcake is not a cheap thing to make. Probably $25 for this one (although some leftover ingredients would go toward the next one). So when we went to eat it yesterday and saw holes in the wrapping, a large hunk of fruitcake missing, and an audacious quantity of mouse poo on the counter top, we were upset on several levels.
I decided then and there that we had allowed the rodent menace to linger too long. We could no longer allow them to plunder our home with impudence, and changing our lifestyle was out of the question, so the Morgans went to war.
We went to the local weapons retailer and armed ourselves appropriately (the regular style trap in the middle–not the giant rat trap, or the new-fangled plastic ones). I remember my great-grandmother using peanut butter and cheese, so I got a hunk of moldy Havarti from the fridge, put a smidgeon of peanut butter on it, and left one trap on the countertop (where the ill-fated fruitcake had been) and one under the counter. When we went to bed, there were no dead mice, but the bait from one was missing. Then I remembered that the peanut butter went on bottom so that the cheese stuck to the trap. I reset it, and this morning we scored our first victory. It was far more grusesome than I remember mice being, leaving a large smear of blood on our countertop. I also noticed that this mouse was a she, with noticable teats, so there might be a small horde of recently weened mice somewhere. I reloaded, and when we came back from the ball game tonight we had scored a second victory, this time a somewhat smaller, unbloodied male.
I want to emphasize that we did not want this fight. We are not violent people. Rather, this fight was forced on us by animals unwilling to live in the domain they already had, but hellbent on taking that which was ours. We did not start it, but we will wage it with brutal efficiency, and we will win. For those wondering how my views on coercive interrogation might affect this conflict, I can assure you that no quarter will be asked and none given. Although for those of you worrying about war without end–”How will you know when all of the mice are dead and you can return to normal? What does victory look like? What’s the exit strategy?”–I answer only that your questions will not weaken our resolve to see this conflict through.
As of 9/30/2006, the casualty count is Mice-2, Morgans-1.
Apollo posted this at 11:02 PM CDT on Saturday, September 30th, 2006 as Ourselves
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Highlights from Dean Barrett:
1) Let’s get right to it. Do you support torture?
Let me say what I do support: When it comes to high value targets in the war on terror, wannabe evil-doers who possess or might possess important information, I support any measures necessary to extract that information.
2) So you support torture! I am gobsmacked and filled with heartache.
There you go again, making erroneous conclusions without really knowing what you’re talking about. What is commonly considered torture – the rack, breaking kneecaps, bamboo under the finger-nails – is useless for extracting actionable information. Such techniques can get the victim to confess to anything under the sun but if it’s intelligence you seek, they’re not very helpful. And if you read a book like “Confessions of an Innocent Man” which details the hell a North American went through in a Saudi Arabian prison, you know these techniques spring from deeply sadistic souls, not committed professionals.
3) But I watch Jack Bauer on “24” and see him getting everything he needs by brandishing a pistol and with a judiciously placed blow. What gives?
It may have escaped you, but “24” is not a documentary, nor is it a scholarly inquiry on effective interrogation techniques.
4) So what does the actual scholarship say?
The key to gathering information is to disorient the subject. If you disorient the subject enough, he lets go of his secrets. Discomfort is actually much more useful than pain.
5) What’s the best way to get information?
9) What do you think?
I don’t care. If some body of linguists or semanticists convened a weekend retreat in Cambridge, impartially studied the issue and labeled it torture, I still wouldn’t care. The welfare of terrorists is not my concern. Even if all the Jack Bauer-type crap you see on “24” was the best way to go, I’d still be okay with it.
10) But it’s not just terrorists. It’s suspected terrorists. Surely that bothers you.
It does. It’s inevitable that innocent people will be subjected to this kind of treatment. But this is war, and in war we make moral compromises. For example, normally we don’t like to kill people. In war, we try to kill people by the thousands. That Amnesty International guy that I was on TV with last night kept whining that we wouldn’t be having any of this if it weren’t for 9/11. Duh. If we weren’t at war, we could comfortably remain in the moral sphere that we aspire to. But right now, that’s not an option.
11) But we didn’t do stuff like this in World War II, did we?
I don’t know. But I do know we fire-bombed Dresden. I know we dropped atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I know that in doing these things we knowingly engaged in actions that killed tens of thousands of innocents. When you’re at war, moral compromises are part of the deal.
Thoughtful stuff. Worth a gander.
Hubbard posted this at 8:02 PM CDT on Saturday, September 30th, 2006 as Global War on Terror, Philosophy
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That’ll be Bill Clinton’s fate.
Hubbard posted this at 7:43 PM CDT on Saturday, September 30th, 2006 as Humor
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I’m interesting in seeing The Queen. It deals with the time immediately following the death of Princess Diana. At the time, Theodore Dalrymple wrote:
But when it was established that the driver of Diana’s car was drunk, and that he had been going absurdly fast through the tunnel, the gutter press regained its confidence and immediately mounted a campaign to force the queen to express her grief in public and to fly the national flag at half-mast over the royal palace, though this was against the custom and usage of centuries. The combined circulation of these newspapers is 12 million, and perhaps half the population of the country reads one or the other of them; so the queen bowed to what must have seemed like popular pressure, though it was in fact the simulated rage of a handful of editors who were conducting a struggle to maintain circulation at a difficult time. No one stopped to think that the tradition of not flying the flag at half-mast over the palace was a symbolic representation of the idea that, while individuals come and go, the institution survives them and is more important than they; or that, by demanding that the queen express grief in public, the newspapers were demanding either that she express an emotion she did not feel, or that she should not be allowed to grieve in private. Either way was to trivialize and cheapen the emotion.
But the queen outwitted the editors. In her television address to the nation, which they had demanded, she managed to avoid what would have been patently dishonest avowals of affection for her ex-daughter-in-law, while avowing admiration for such qualities as her energy—a distinctly double-edged quality in someone of whose activities one does not entirely approve.
With that in mind, here’s the text of the queen’s address:
Since last Sunday’s dreadful news, we have seen through-out Britain and around the world, an overwhelming expression of sadness at Diana’s death. We have all been trying in our different ways to cope. It is not easy to express the sense of loss, since the initial shock is often succeeded by a mixture of other feelings, disbelief, incomprehension, anger, and concern for those who remain. We have all felt those emotions in these last few days, so what I say to you now, as your queen and as a grandmother, I say from my heart. First, I want to pay tribute to Diana myself. She was an exceptional and gifted human being. In good times and bad, she never lost her capacity to smile and laugh, nor to inspire others with her warmth and kindness. I admired and respected her, for her energy and committment to others, and especially, for her devotion to her two boys. This week, at Balmoral, we have all been trying to help William and Harry come to terms with the devastating loss that they, and the rest of us, have suffered. No one who knew Diana will ever forget her. Millions of others who never met her, but felt they knew her, will remember her. I, for one, believe there are lessons to be drawn from her life, and from the extraordinary and moving reaction to her death. I share in your determination to cherish her memory. This is also an opportunity for me, on behalf of my family, and especially Prince Charles and William and Harry, to thank all of you who have brought flowers, sent messages, and paid your respects in so many ways, to a remarkable person. These acts of kindness have been a huge source of help and comfort. Our thoughts are also with Diana’s family, and the families of those who died with her. I know that they too have drawn strength from what has happened since last weekend, as they seek to heal their sorrow and then to face the future without a loved one. I hope that tomorrow, we can all, wherever we are, join in expressing our grief at Diana’s loss, and gratitude for her all too short life. It is a chance to show to the whole world the British nation united in grief and respect. May those who died rest in peace, and may we, each and every one of us, thank God for someone who made many, many people happy.
Shrewd speech-writing, that. The movie looks interesting. Pity it’s not opening where I am.
Hubbard posted this at 11:01 AM CDT on Friday, September 29th, 2006 as Kulturkampf, Those Wacky Foreigners
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Thanks to Republicans in the Virginia state house, another year will pass without my taxes going up.
Apollo posted this at 9:38 AM CDT on Friday, September 29th, 2006 as An Insult to Drunken Sailors
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I normally don’t mind negative campaigning, even harsh personal attacks. It’s always struck me as the best way to keep undesireable people out of office. But the Virginia senate race has crossed some sort of line. It’s no longer a race to the bottom, I’m pretty sure they’ve just reached it.* Now the Sons of Confederate Veterans (either that’s a group whose name is no longer literal, or else it’s a very, very small, very, very old group) are saying that Allen is improperly attacking the Confederate flag. Since when does the Washington Post publish stories about the Sons of Confederate Veterans, treating them as a serious group? Since they started attacking Post target #1, George Allen. Perhaps if the Klan issued a release saying that Allen didn’t use the N-word often enough, that too would merit Post coverage at this point.
The Allen campaign seems to be belatedly doing the correct thing, which is to throw as much mud as it can grab at Webb to dull the effects of all personal attacks. At this point, the story in the campaign has changed from, “Is George Allen a racist?” to “Man, what a filthy campaign this is.” The anti-Allen attacks (and I say this without any comment on their validity) have come so fast that they are now backfiring. No one wants to believe this about someone who has won as many elections as George Allen has.
This is all come as Allen released an absolutely devestating ad. I agree with National Review that charges of misogeny are not how I’d spend my campaign, but Webb has to rack up enormous margins in the Northern Virginia burbs to have a shot, so watch this ad with the thought that it’s aimed at wishy-washy upper middle class white women.
*In a just world, every time the Washington Post runs one of their preachy editorials about negative campaigning and cynicism in politics, someone should rub their noses in the macaca they’ve published about George Allen. Like I say, I don’t mind negative campaigns and personal attacks, but the Post pretends to. Until they get to use them to turn their paper into a partisan weapon against a particular senator.
Apollo posted this at 9:31 AM CDT on Friday, September 29th, 2006 as Journalism, Politics
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What’s China up to?
China has secretly fired powerful laser weapons designed to disable American spy satellites by “blinding” their sensitive surveillance devices, it was reported Monday.
The hitherto unreported attacks have been kept secret by the Bush administration for fear that they would damage attempts to co-opt China in diplomatic offensives against North Korea and Iran.
Sources told the military affairs publication Defense News that a fierce internal battle had occurred within Washington over whether to make the attacks public. In the end, the Pentagon’s annual assessment of the growing Chinese military buildup barely mentioned the threat.
“After a contentious debate, the White House directed the Pentagon to limit its concern to one line,” Defense News said.
The document said China could blind American satellites with a ground-based laser firing a beam of light to prevent spy photography as they pass over China.
According to senior American officials: “China not only has the capability but has exercised it.”
American satellites like the giant Keyhole craft have come under attack “several times” in recent years.
Although the Chinese tests do not aim to destroy American satellites, the laser attacks could make them useless over Chinese territory.
The American military has been so alarmed by the Chinese activity that it has begun test attacks against its own satellites to determine the severity of the threat. Satellites are especially vulnerable to attack because they have predetermined orbits, allowing an enemy to know where they will appear.
“The Chinese are very strategically minded and are extremely active in this arena. They really believe all the stuff written in the 1980s about the High Frontier,” a former senior Pentagon official said.
Parts of the American military establishment have become increasingly alarmed over China’s growing military ambitions.
Military experts have already noted that Chinese military expenditure is increasingly designed to challenge American military pre-eminence by investing in weaponry that can attack key systems such as aircraft carriers and satellites.
At the same time, China is engaged in a large-scale espionage effort against American high-tech firms working on projects such as the multibillion-dollar DD(X) destroyer program.
Hubbard posted this at 9:16 AM CDT on Friday, September 29th, 2006 as Commie Recrudescence
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It leaves me cringing, but it just might work.
Hubbard posted this at 5:26 PM CDT on Thursday, September 28th, 2006 as Humor, Random Bloggish Things
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This earlier post—about the need for a thoughtful debate about the treatment of terrorists—started an interesting discussion in the comments section, though admittedly the first few comments were somewhat less than thoughtful. Fortunately, we had Apollo around to elevate the discussion.
This debate got me thinking about how the terrorists are being treated, and how roughly we can interrogate them. Nobody is seriously calling for a return to iron maidens or thumbscrews or even Chinese water torture. What, exactly, is going on right now in Guantanamo?
Richard Miniter had this report:
Detainees are entitled to a full eight hours sleep and can’t be woken up for interrogations. They enjoy three meals and five prayers per day, without interruption. They are entitled to a minimum of two hours of outdoor recreation per day.
Interrogations are limited to four hours, usually running two — and (of course) are interrupted for prayers. One interrogator actually bakes cookies for detainees, while another serves them Subway or McDonald’s sandwiches. Both are available on base. (Filet o’ Fish is an al Qaeda favorite.)
Interrogations are not video or audio taped, perhaps to preserve detainee privacy. [emphasis added]
Call it excessive compassion by a nation devoted to therapy, but it’s dangerous. Adm. Harris admitted to me that a multi-cell al Qaeda network has developed in the camp. Military intelligence can’t yet identify their leaders, but notes that they have cells for monitoring the movements and identities of guards and doctors, cells dedicated to training, others for making weapons and so on.
And they can make weapons from almost anything. Guards have been attacked with springs taken from inside faucets, broken fluorescent light bulbs and fan blades. Some are more elaborate. “These folks are MacGyvers,” Harris said.
Other cells pass messages from leaders in one camp to followers in others. How? Detainees use the envelopes sent to them by their attorneys to pass messages. (Some 1,000 lawyers represent 440 prisoners, all on a pro bono basis, with more than 18,500 letters in and out of Gitmo in the past year.) Guards are not allowed to look inside these envelopes because of “attorney-client privilege” — even if they know the document inside is an Arabic-language note written by a prisoner to another prisoner and not a letter to or from a lawyer.
That’s right: Accidentally or not, American lawyers are helping al Qaeda prisoners continue to plot.
James Taranto corroborates this treatment:
To prevent more suicide attempts, “the detention group commander ordered a shakedown of all the cells. He was going through each of the cells looking for contraband, looking for pills. He found some, throughout the day. He found some hidden around the toilet area; he found some hidden in the bindings of the Holy Quran.” (Each detainee receives a personal Quran in his native language, which non-Muslim guards are forbidden to touch.)
Early in the evening, the search reached Camp 4, the least restrictive of the detention areas. Unlike in the other camps, detainees in Camp 4 are not confined to individual cells but bunk communally and congregate in fenced yards. This is where the detainees live who are most compliant with camp rules. But on that day in May, their cooperation came to an end.
A guard noticed a detainee who appeared to be trying to hang himself. “The detainee had put a sheet in the ceiling around the lights and built what looked like a noose and was putting his head toward that noose,” Adm. Harris says. “The quick-reaction force rushed into that [cell] block to save the life of the individual they thought was trying to kill himself. When they got in there, the detainees had slickened the floor with feces, urine and soapy water,” making it hard for the guards to keep their footing.
“They proceeded to attack the guard force. . . . The attack was obviously planned. They managed to get a guard down on the ground. They attacked him with broken light fixtures, with fan blades and with [security] cameras that they had torn off to use as bludgeoning weapons. In that process the NCOIC [noncommissioned officer in charge] made the call—a gutsy call—to fire less-than-lethal rounds at the detainees. . . . All that took about three to five minutes. . . . The disturbance was quelled. No one was seriously injured, either the guards or the detainees.
“But at the same time, detainees in two adjacent blocks erupted and tore up their blocks completely–tore down all the lights, tore up all the fans, tore down all the cameras, and all that kind of stuff. They didn’t attack the guards, but they did manage to tear up the blocks.” In only one Camp 4 cell block did the detainees not riot: “When the uprising, or whatever you call it, happened, they went back into their block very quietly and stood by the beds,” Adm. Harris says. “Today, those are the only residents of Camp 4.” When I toured the camp, I saw perhaps eight of them, dressed in white, lolling about their outdoor yard. The other blocks are being repaired and made more secure, at a cost to the taxpayer of about $800,000.
I am unaware of any other war in which detainees have been treated so well. This despite the fact that our captured troops are likely to be videotaped getting beheaded. It seems we should be less concerned with torture than with too lenient treatment.
Hubbard posted this at 7:23 AM CDT on Thursday, September 28th, 2006 as Another Great Victory For Jihad, Kulturkampf, Philosophy
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Yesterday was the most exciting day in fashion (i.e., the only day worth paying attention to), namely the day of the Prada show at Milan. I’ve praised Miuccia Prada in this space before, and her show yesterday did not disappoint. Style.com summed it up with “Miuccia takes Milan by surprise again.” The fashion industry is a pretty callous, cynical one, and it’s hard to genuinely shock them. However, no one can fail to be surprised by the world’s premier fashion designer putting on a pantless fasion show.
I’ve seen London, and I’ve seen France, and, well, check out the slideshow for more models showing off their skivvies. Miuccia says she didn’t like any of the pants she designed this year, so she sent them out pantless. Egad.
Yesterday was Gwyneth Paltrow’s 34th birthday. Back in high school, I thought she was one of the most beautiful actresses on the screen, but the last few years have not been kind to Gwyneth. Aside from being exposed as a blithering nitwit on political matters, she’s aged about 25 years in the last 6. If I were to travel back to my high school self and say that, in a decade, 1) Gwyneth Paltrow would be less hot than Heather Locklear, and 2) Britney Spears would pose naked for the cover of a magazine and my reaction would be gaping horror, my high school self would probably have bet his car that I was wrong. Though I wouldn’t take that bet, because that Civic might be the only thing has aged worse than Gwyneth.
Dustin Diamond, the actor formerly known as Screech, is now a porn star. In “What’s That Smell,” he allegedly does something to a girl that I won’t describe on a family site like this one. Again, egad.
Apollo posted this at 1:01 AM CDT on Thursday, September 28th, 2006 as Pop Culture Is Filth
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Over at the UN:
All the declared candidates are from Asia — which under an informal rotation system expects to field the next secretary-general — except Mrs. Vike-Freiberga, whose candidacy could sink on the geographic considerations despite the fact that several nations would like to see a woman in the post.
China, a veto-wielding permanent member of the U.N. Security Council, signaled early that it would not accept a candidate from a country outside Asia.
Gah. The whole system is annoying. Still, if they insist on putting an Asian in the Secretary General’s chair, why not Lee Kuan Yew? That’d be fun to watch, if nothing else.
Hubbard posted this at 12:56 PM CDT on Wednesday, September 27th, 2006 as Dis-United Nations
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At the first battle of Manassas, General Barnard Bee observed a Virginia brigade commanded by Thomas Jackson standing pat while awaiting a Union charge. “There stands Jackson like a stone wall, rally behind the Virginians,” he said, and Stonewall Jackson was born. Traditional use has it that it was a compliment; some revisioninsts say that it was intended as a complaint that Jackson was not helping out nearby units who were in trouble. Either way, it was true enough.
Now, fast-forward to present-day Virginia (and indeed, Mansassas is at the center of the fray). For the uninitiated, Virginia has a billion dollars in surplus, and will have surpluses into the next few years. It also has some serious traffic problems in northern Virginia and in the Hampton Roads area near Norfolk and Virginia Beach. Tim Kaine won last year’s governor’s election largely on a platform of improving transportation within the commonwealth. However, once the legislative session began he refused to build any new road unless there was a “sustainable” source of funding. Naturally, this meant “tax increases.” His plan seemed almost certain to pass earlier this year (it passed the Republican-controlled senate), but then some Republicans in the assembly grew a backbone and rejected the plan, happily saving your humble corespondent several dollars a year.
There was, though, no transportation plan passed at all, which is a serious defeat for Kaine. So the governor called for a special 3-day session that started yesterday. And there stood the Republicans, like a stone wall.
Kevin Hall, a spokesman for Kaine, said: “It’s disappointing that the House majority is refusing to consider new revenue for our obvious transportation challenges. Their answer appears to be borrowing and diverting money from public schools, colleges, public safety and public health. That is no way to pay for a 21st-century transportation network.”
Oh oh oh, I like this game. Let me try!
Apollo Morgan, a self-appointed spokesman for Virginians who think they already pay too much in taxes, said: “It’s riveting that the House majority is refusing to let the government dig its hand even further into my pocket, and instead believes that the government should shift its spending priorities. The governor’s answer is to divert money that could be spent on my student loan payments, my personal safety, and my personal health. That is no way to pay for a 21st-century transportation network.”
Rally behind the assembly Republicans!
Apollo posted this at 10:14 AM CDT on Wednesday, September 27th, 2006 as An Insult to Drunken Sailors
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Jonah Goldberg tries to apply some logic to the tortured torture debate. He starts with a good old metaphor:
When confronted with the assertion that the Soviet Union and the United States were moral equivalents, William F. Buckley responded that if one man pushes an old lady into an oncoming bus and another man pushes an old lady out of the way of a bus, we should not denounce them both as men who push old ladies around.
In other words, context matters.
In every society in the world, murder is punished more harshly than non-lethal torture. If I waterboard you, or lock you in my basement with Duran Duran blasting at you 24/7, even if I beat you for hours with a rubber hose, my punishment will be less severe than if I murder you, simply because it is worse to take a life deliberately than to cause pain, even sadistically. We all understand this. Would you rather take some lumps in a dungeon for a month, or take a dirt nap forever?
Yet, according to the torture prohibitionists, there must be a complete ban on anything that even looks like torture, regardless of context, even though we’d never dream of a blanket ban on killing.
One reason for this disconnect is that we’ve thought a lot about killing and barely at all about torture. Almost no one opposes killing in all circumstances; wars sometimes need to be fought, the hopelessly suffering may require relief, we reserve the right to self-defense. Indeed, the law recognizes a host of nuances when it comes to homicide, and the place where everybody draws an unambiguous line on killing is at something we call “murder.”
But there is no equivalent word for murder when it comes to torture. It’s always evil. Yet that’s not our universal reaction. In movies and on TV, good men force evil men to give up information via methods no nicer than what the CIA is allegedly employing. If torture is a categorical evil, shouldn’t we boo Jack Bauer on Fox’s “24″? There’s a reason we keep hearing about the ticking time bomb scenario in the torture debate: Is abuse justified in getting a prisoner to reveal the location of a bomb that would kill many when detonated? We understand that in such a situation, Americans would expect to be protected. That’s why human-rights activists have tried to declare this scenario a red herring.
Sullivan complains that calling torture “aggressive interrogation techniques” doesn’t make torture any better. Fair enough. But calling aggressive interrogation techniques “torture” when they’re not doesn’t make such techniques any worse.
Goldberg calls for a serious debate. Let’s hope there is one.
Hubbard posted this at 9:33 AM CDT on Wednesday, September 27th, 2006 as Global War on Terror, Politics and the English Language, There Is Only One God And Jonah Goldberg Is His Prophet
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Lefty hearts are fluttering over Bill Clinton’s finger-wagging, fist-face tantrum on Fox television. Party boss Howard Dean, a noted rage-aholic, sees Clinton’s fury as a model for “what Democrats need to do in this election.”Dean’s approval is one way to know you’re in trouble with moderate voters. Another way is to calculate who wins and loses with Clinton’s outburst. My scorecard says Fox wins with top ratings and Bubba wins ’cause he loves getting headlines.
Hillary loses. Big time. So big, in fact, that I think she ought to finally kick the bum out.
Out of her campaign, that is.
Thanks to her iconic status as the first First Lady ever to hold elective office, Clinton’s career isn’t just a personal issue. Along with having the best chance a woman has ever had to be elected President goes a set of obligations. One of them is to run as her own person and not as an appendage.
I don’t know whether she has the right stuff to be President. I do know she doesn’t have a chance unless she gets out from under The Big Creep’s shadow.
To be fair, Clinton deserves much credit for raising billions to fund his charitable work in the world’s dirtiest trenches, from tsunami reconstruction to the fight against AIDS. Understandably, he wanted to talk about those issues, which comprise the legacy he is working so hard to create. His “precious,” as Gollum would put it.
But his legacy also includes an iconic gesture — the wagging finger. Clinton’s marmish scolding of Wallace was a telling moment, much like another time he wagged his finger on television.
He did not have sex with that woman, Miss Lewinsky. And he did not fail to connect the dots concerning that man, Mr. bin Laden.
Hubbard posted this at 9:24 AM CDT on Wednesday, September 27th, 2006 as Uncategorized
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I absolutely believe that he admitted to being a crap weasel. That is absolute correct and I do believe that. I’m not going to go into any more details here. There is other evidence that I’m not going to go into on this blog. We’ve had a nice talk.
(I can’t wait to see this story in tomorrow’s New York Times!)
Apollo posted this at 1:57 PM CDT on Tuesday, September 26th, 2006 as Journalism, Politics
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