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	<title>Comments on: Some concerns</title>
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	<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/</link>
	<description>Constitution Fanboys</description>
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		<title>By: Geoff</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143416</link>
		<dc:creator>Geoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 14:23:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143416</guid>
		<description>Apollo -

The hypocrites here aren&#039;t the poor evangelical families.  It&#039;s the politicians and pundits who think that pregnant teens are almost as good as gays for bashing in the name of values, until it becomes politically inopportune.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apollo -</p>
<p>The hypocrites here aren&#8217;t the poor evangelical families.  It&#8217;s the politicians and pundits who think that pregnant teens are almost as good as gays for bashing in the name of values, until it becomes politically inopportune.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143412</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 13:49:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143412</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Just to be clear, I agree that Bristol’s pregnancy should be considered out of bounds for attacks and rumor-mongering. I just object to the pose of aggrieved innocence coming from the right.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
I confess I&#039;m with Geoff on this one.  In the context of ordinary life evangelicals and the religious right in general are compassionate and loving in ways that would shock the average liberal.  Moreover, that love and compassion wouldn&#039;t be working against their values, but would be informed by them.

All of those higher values, however, would evaporate if this was the daughter of a liberal politician, especially a liberal presidential candidate, especially Barack Obama.  &lt;em&gt;What kind of an example does this set for our daughters?  How am I going to explain this to them? This wouldn&#039;t have happened if her parents had put family -- not their father&#039;s career -- first!  If only they taught abstinence in the schools!
&lt;/em&gt;

Everyone is looking at this pregnancy and trying to figure out what it means about themselves or their pet issues. For crying out loud,  &lt;a rel=&quot;nofollow&quot; href=&quot;http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=MTRhN2Q1YTg4OGE4ZjkzMjM5YjgyNzdiZTQwYjdmYWM=&quot;&gt;Mark Krikorian&lt;/a&gt; is waxing about the beauty of the  Palins&#039; collective virility and fertility while denigrating the Obamas&#039; relative bareness by having a paltry two kids.  It&#039;s only a matter of time before PZ Myers starts posting about how Bristol&#039;s kid marks a new evolutionary leap for humanity, which those ignorant, snake-handling, narrow-minded believers are just too &lt;em&gt;stupid&lt;/em&gt; to see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Just to be clear, I agree that Bristol’s pregnancy should be considered out of bounds for attacks and rumor-mongering. I just object to the pose of aggrieved innocence coming from the right.</p></blockquote>
<p>I confess I&#8217;m with Geoff on this one.  In the context of ordinary life evangelicals and the religious right in general are compassionate and loving in ways that would shock the average liberal.  Moreover, that love and compassion wouldn&#8217;t be working against their values, but would be informed by them.</p>
<p>All of those higher values, however, would evaporate if this was the daughter of a liberal politician, especially a liberal presidential candidate, especially Barack Obama.  <em>What kind of an example does this set for our daughters?  How am I going to explain this to them? This wouldn&#8217;t have happened if her parents had put family &#8212; not their father&#8217;s career &#8212; first!  If only they taught abstinence in the schools!<br />
</em></p>
<p>Everyone is looking at this pregnancy and trying to figure out what it means about themselves or their pet issues. For crying out loud,  <a rel="nofollow" href="http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=MTRhN2Q1YTg4OGE4ZjkzMjM5YjgyNzdiZTQwYjdmYWM=">Mark Krikorian</a> is waxing about the beauty of the  Palins&#8217; collective virility and fertility while denigrating the Obamas&#8217; relative bareness by having a paltry two kids.  It&#8217;s only a matter of time before PZ Myers starts posting about how Bristol&#8217;s kid marks a new evolutionary leap for humanity, which those ignorant, snake-handling, narrow-minded believers are just too <em>stupid</em> to see.</p>
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		<title>By: Hubbard</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143406</link>
		<dc:creator>Hubbard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 13:23:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143406</guid>
		<description>Geoff---

Did Chelsea Clinton&#039;s mishaps ever rate &lt;b&gt;three&lt;/b&gt; front page stories on the same day in the &lt;i&gt;New York Times&lt;/i&gt;, as poor Bristol Palin&#039;s did yesterday?  She certainly got some harsh jokes made at her expense (one of them from &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/01/12/obama-wont-unify-america/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;McCain&lt;/A&gt;, which is good to remember) but I cannot recall any kind of media madness like this around Miss Clinton.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Geoff&#8212;</p>
<p>Did Chelsea Clinton&#8217;s mishaps ever rate <b>three</b> front page stories on the same day in the <i>New York Times</i>, as poor Bristol Palin&#8217;s did yesterday?  She certainly got some harsh jokes made at her expense (one of them from <a HREF="http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/01/12/obama-wont-unify-america/" rel="nofollow">McCain</a>, which is good to remember) but I cannot recall any kind of media madness like this around Miss Clinton.</p>
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		<title>By: Apollo</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143357</link>
		<dc:creator>Apollo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 03:44:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143357</guid>
		<description>Geoff,

I get the feeling you don&#039;t hang out too much in evangelical circles. A large number of them either were teenage mothers themselves or the children of teenage mothers. For a while now the focus of right-wingers in such situation has been on the importance of not killing the baby. Though it&#039;s worth pointing out that it&#039;s possible to view such situations as both negative examples and still as human stories deserving of love and compassion; Dr. Laura very often does an excellent job of this.

If you want condescension toward teenage mothers, there&#039;s an awful lot of it that comes from not Republicans and conservatives. Obama described unplanned teenage pregnancies as &quot;punishment.&quot; Feminists see young mothers not going to college and tut-tut about them not living up to their potential. There&#039;s a cultural elitism in America that resides largely on the left, and it looks down on people who have a family when they&#039;re poor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Geoff,</p>
<p>I get the feeling you don&#8217;t hang out too much in evangelical circles. A large number of them either were teenage mothers themselves or the children of teenage mothers. For a while now the focus of right-wingers in such situation has been on the importance of not killing the baby. Though it&#8217;s worth pointing out that it&#8217;s possible to view such situations as both negative examples and still as human stories deserving of love and compassion; Dr. Laura very often does an excellent job of this.</p>
<p>If you want condescension toward teenage mothers, there&#8217;s an awful lot of it that comes from not Republicans and conservatives. Obama described unplanned teenage pregnancies as &#8220;punishment.&#8221; Feminists see young mothers not going to college and tut-tut about them not living up to their potential. There&#8217;s a cultural elitism in America that resides largely on the left, and it looks down on people who have a family when they&#8217;re poor.</p>
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		<title>By: Geoff</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143353</link>
		<dc:creator>Geoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 03:29:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143353</guid>
		<description>Just to be clear, I agree that Bristol&#039;s pregnancy should be considered out of bounds for attacks and rumor-mongering.  I just object to the pose of aggrieved innocence coming from the right. 

Of course, maybe I&#039;m being too cynical.  Maybe instead of using them as fodder for the culture wars, Republican politicians and commentators will start looking at other teenage mothers as human stories, as people who tried to be good but fell short.  Even if they aren&#039;t the daughter of a VP candidate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just to be clear, I agree that Bristol&#8217;s pregnancy should be considered out of bounds for attacks and rumor-mongering.  I just object to the pose of aggrieved innocence coming from the right. </p>
<p>Of course, maybe I&#8217;m being too cynical.  Maybe instead of using them as fodder for the culture wars, Republican politicians and commentators will start looking at other teenage mothers as human stories, as people who tried to be good but fell short.  Even if they aren&#8217;t the daughter of a VP candidate.</p>
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		<title>By: Geoff</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143344</link>
		<dc:creator>Geoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 02:09:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143344</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;There’s a difference between politicians in the arena and children of politicians—at least to the right. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

*ahem*chelseaclinton*ahem*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>There’s a difference between politicians in the arena and children of politicians—at least to the right. </p></blockquote>
<p>*ahem*chelseaclinton*ahem*</p>
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		<title>By: Hubbard</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143339</link>
		<dc:creator>Hubbard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 01:14:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143339</guid>
		<description>Geoff---

I don&#039;t recall social conservatives making a huge deal about Albert Gore III&#039;s speeding tickets or marijuana use.  There&#039;s a difference between politicians in the arena and children of politicians---at least to the right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Geoff&#8212;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t recall social conservatives making a huge deal about Albert Gore III&#8217;s speeding tickets or marijuana use.  There&#8217;s a difference between politicians in the arena and children of politicians&#8212;at least to the right.</p>
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		<title>By: Geoff</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143291</link>
		<dc:creator>Geoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Sep 2008 21:54:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143291</guid>
		<description>Re: an older Sasha Obama. I think most social cons would shrug and say, “Well, that’s what 17 year olds do.”

Certainly, they would never use it as an example of the lack of values of the Democrats.  They would never, ever do that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re: an older Sasha Obama. I think most social cons would shrug and say, “Well, that’s what 17 year olds do.”</p>
<p>Certainly, they would never use it as an example of the lack of values of the Democrats.  They would never, ever do that.</p>
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		<title>By: Hubbard</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143278</link>
		<dc:creator>Hubbard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Sep 2008 21:00:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143278</guid>
		<description>Tom---

Re: an older Sasha Obama.  I think most social cons would shrug and say, &quot;Well, that&#039;s what 17 year olds do.&quot;  I&#039;d agree with you if Bristol were a few years younger.  By the time kids can drive (which is age 14 in Alaska) it&#039;s not really feasible for parents to be keeping watch over their kids all the time.

Apollo---

I think a better way to have handled this would have been when Sarah Palin gave the speech introducing herself, she could point out her husband, her children, and her eldest daughter&#039;s fiance.  That would have prevented a lot of grief.  But you&#039;re absolutely right that this isn&#039;t just an overblown story, it&#039;s &lt;i&gt;crap on top of lies covered in garbage sauce.&lt;/I&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom&#8212;</p>
<p>Re: an older Sasha Obama.  I think most social cons would shrug and say, &#8220;Well, that&#8217;s what 17 year olds do.&#8221;  I&#8217;d agree with you if Bristol were a few years younger.  By the time kids can drive (which is age 14 in Alaska) it&#8217;s not really feasible for parents to be keeping watch over their kids all the time.</p>
<p>Apollo&#8212;</p>
<p>I think a better way to have handled this would have been when Sarah Palin gave the speech introducing herself, she could point out her husband, her children, and her eldest daughter&#8217;s fiance.  That would have prevented a lot of grief.  But you&#8217;re absolutely right that this isn&#8217;t just an overblown story, it&#8217;s <i>crap on top of lies covered in garbage sauce.</i></p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/comment-page-1/#comment-143274</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Sep 2008 20:53:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://federalistpaupers.com/index.php/2008/09/02/some-concerns/#comment-143274</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;When’s a good time to introduce that?&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Sometime before the mud-slingers found it.
&lt;blockquote&gt;I’ve spent the past four days trying to fit this into the Dune theory. Unsuccessfully.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
It&#039;s a tricky one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>When’s a good time to introduce that?</p></blockquote>
<p>Sometime before the mud-slingers found it.</p>
<blockquote><p>I’ve spent the past four days trying to fit this into the Dune theory. Unsuccessfully.</p></blockquote>
<p>It&#8217;s a tricky one.</p>
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