Not exactly the methods we’ve been told we need.
But…but…but ticking timebombs…but…but…but Jack Bauer.
Posted by Jamie in Iraq
December 3rd, 2008
How to Break a Terrorist
6 Responses to “How to Break a Terrorist”
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Apollo says:
What makes that story so persuasive is that it doesn’t once mention international law or make some sort of ridiculous claim that these terrorists are entitled to Geneva Convention rights. I only think it’s appropriate to torture terrorists because it works; if we can get the same information through other methods, that’s probably superior.
Though I’ll add two things. He doesn’t put a timeline on how long his method takes. I’d imagine it takes, at a bare minimum, several days. That’s great for most situations, but surely there are situations where information is needed quickly. Jack Bauer would be fine making friends with people if he had the time, but when there’s no time, digits come off. Of course, ritualized torture (e.g. waterboarding) is seldom an option in situations where time is of the essence.
Second, he says that the CIA “repeatedly” waterboarded people. This is technically true, but it’s deceptive. Each time waterboarding is mentioned, people need to be reminded that we’ve spent the last six years debating a “torture” method that was used thrice. I don’t think it would weaken Mr. Alexander’s argument, but it’s the sort of information that should be repeated so that people know it. To simply say that we’ve “repeatedly” waterboarded people is to feed into the common misperception that we waterboarded half the Arab world.
December 3rd, 2008 at 6:28 pm -
Jamie says:
Agreed, Apollo. In the end I’m a pragmatist – while the thought of the US government torturing people is reprehensible to me, I understand that somethings may be necessary given the right conditions. However, to my knowledge we have yet to encounter the sort of ticking time-bomb scenario in which I could be persuaded torture techniques such as waterboarding are a necessary evil. As a pragmatist I favor the technique best equipped to extract the most information from these scumbags – if that’s pretending to be their friend and bringing them milk and cookies rather than stomping on their holy books and smearing fake menstrual blood on them then the faster we can kill their friends.
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Robert says:
This reminds me of the story
http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/0212/p99s01-duts.html
referencing the West Point Brigadier General visiting the ‘24′ producers and asking them to reduce the show’s emphasis on torture.I’ve never seen the show, myself, but from what I’ve heard, it bears as much resemblance to real-world circumstances as most television shows do.
Bizarre digression: in More’s ‘Utopia’, one of the techniques the Utopians used to avoid going to war was assassination. If a neighboring country was suspected of planning to attack, the Utopian government would announce that anyone _from that country_ who assassinated the leader and escaped to Utopia would be given asylum and a generous pension. I’m doing this from memory, so the details are foggy; but the point was that they believed this to be preferable to risking their own blood and treasure. In the college class where we studied the book, I was astonished at the number of my fellow students who found this objectionable. I wonder how many of them have changed their minds by now.
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Tom says:
Though I’ll add two things. He doesn’t put a timeline on how long his method takes. I’d imagine it takes, at a bare minimum, several days. That’s great for most situations, but surely there are situations where information is needed quickly. Jack Bauer would be fine making friends with people if he had the time, but when there’s no time, digits come off.
I’m inclined to agree; my umbrage is that President Bush authorized such things in advance. In any situation involving a ticking time bomb — such situations are ridiculous and rare, but do happen — we have many legal safety nets for interrogators: prosecutors can refuse to press charges, judges can dismiss, and presidents can pardon.
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bigglespilot says:
The Indians faced the ticking time bomb situation this week in the aftermath of the terrorist attacks in Bombay (sic).
Reportedly the terrorists left behind some time bombs – some of which were also booby trapped.
Even if only one life was saved who gives a damn about the welfare a captured terrorist who had just machine gunned in cold blood at least 35 five civilians in the railway station and planted a few bombs to kill more.
And also reportedly the Indians administered Sodium Pentathol as a “truth serum”. Where are the human rights hand wringers over this report? Oh yes – that only applies in America, Australia and the like…..
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Jamie says:
Biggles,
Don’t you hold America, Australia and the like to a higher standard than India? I do.
Also this article makes the case that their methods are more effective than torture – why wouldn’t we use the most effective methods?